Herzliya Conference

The conference has kicked off with some logistical problems and much specualtion over whether Israeli officials will tell the world, once again, that Iran is a big problem.


The former Greek Prime Minister just finished speaking and he is looking as ailing as his county's economy, though he managed to form what appeared to be a huge feat of endurance and actually finished his speech without fainting.
Best quote from the speech: "Eastern Mediteranean is the key to geo-strategic stability" of course you can't confirm that because when journalists asked him for a copy of it, he didn't have one.

At 9 this evening there is a cocktail reception that I haven't been invited to so that's a wrap from me, unless I can bond with any of the important looking people downstairs having whispered conversations where everyone can see them. See you all tomorrow for more fun from Herzliya!

Yoni Jesner

Yoni Jesner was a young Scottish Jew who had come to Israel on his gap year during the second Intifada.

He had planned to study medicine in the UK and then to come to Israel to help the sick.

He was killed when a suicide bomber blew up on the bus he was travelling on in Tel Aviv in September 2002, but his story did not end there, in many ways it had only just begun.

Sometimes from the greatest of tragedies can come the most inspiring acts of good will between human beings. Too often acts of hatred inspire greater hatred and fear between people. In this case, sheer strength of character ensured that rather than make the world a worse place in the name of a murderer a family made the world a better place in the name of their fallen son.

After Yoni had passed away doctors asked his mother whether they could use his organs, the decision made by his mother and what happened afterwards shaped the way that they look at the world and makes the video well worth watching.

The Yoni Jesner Foundation has been established to provide scholarships to students in the UK, promote dialogue on contemporary issues facing the Jewish people today and create educational programmes for schools and the wider Jewish community.

The Lapid Effect

There is a new figure in Israeli politics and his name is Yair Lapid.

To give you some background, Yair Lapid is a popular writer and broadcaster in Israel, his (short) Wiki page is here and an excellent article summing him up in the Guardian is here.

He announced his decision to launch a new political party when it became clear that the Knesset was about to pass a bill requiring that any journalist intending to run for political office had to have a 6 month "cooling off period" in between leaving their job and beginning their campaign.

As far as I am concerned the attempt to enact this law, which has been dubbed the "Lapid law" due to the cynical way in which it was clearly aimed at him, is a clear measure of just how scared many of the current members of the Knesset are of the potential Lapid has to shake things up in the Knesset. Despite only making the announcement to enter politics a little over 2 weeks ago the investigations and smears have begun. Lapid is currently being investigated over the fact that he is studying for a Ph.D, naturally this is an enquiry worthy of the Knesset Education Committee.

Despite this, Lapid is all set to be a force in the next Knesset. He is a very popular and charismatic figure here in the Holy Land and from the few statements he has made so far he seems all set to follow in his father's footsteps. That means it is likely that he will be in favour of a strong separation of Synagogue and State as well as negotiations with the Palestinians leading to withdrawal from the West Bank, he has said in the past that he is in favour of giving up the Golan Heights for peace with Syria.

Since declaring that he is a candidate in the next election Lapid has attacked Kadima and Labour and looks to be creating his own space within the centre left. Whereas what he has to say about these 2 parties may well resonate with voters the criticism Haaretz reported levelled against him by the Member of Knesset (MK) Nachman Shai of Kadima is also true;

"It's not yet clear what Yair Lapid brings to politics and what his political vision is; so far we only know what he isn't," Shai said, adding, "He isn't for either Kadima or Labor. But what is he for? Before he deals with other parties, he should first present his platform and his ideas. "Meanwhile," Shai continued, "Lapid makes do with writing his weekly newspaper column and doesn't answer the tough questions of the media and the public."

Should the guesses made above as to what Lapid's policies will be prove to be correct (and lets face it, they will) the big losers in the election will be the left wing block as the fickle Israeli public switch to his new party. To be honest he isn't facing particularly daunting opposition. Labour were in disarray long before Lapid announced his political intentions and still haven't recovered from the pounding they received from the general public at the last general election when being lead by Barak. The current leader, Shelly Yachimovich, is at best an unknown quantity and at worst an entirely unknown figure who has barely made it into the consciousness of the general public since taking the reigns of the Labour party. As for Kadima they are on the verge of all out leadership contest between Livni the current head and Shaul Mofaz, yet another former Chief of Staff turned politician.

What is certain is that Lapid has breathed fresh life into Israeli politics and has injected some fear into a large swathe of MK's across the political divide. I doubt that this PhD scandal will particularly affect his popularity with potential voters and he still has plenty of time to release a manifesto stating exactly what his policies are.

Nehemia Shtrasler wrote a particularly good if typically pessimistic assessment in Haaretz about the fickle cosmopolitan voters Lapid will be courting.

Writing

I wish to write though I have yet to find a way of turning that wish into action.

The few words that I write taunt me, they whisper to me the moment they appear on the page, they boast of their banality, of their sheer average impact on the reader.

In desperation I turned to Google begging for the G-d of the modern age to let me know that I am not alone, that this is something all writers face, I dream of hearing something that will make it easier.

I found this letter written to me, you and anyone who ever dreamed of making the written word their vehicle to move forward through this life that we lead.

John Steinbeck wrote it in 1963

Dear Writer:

Although it must be a thousand years ago that I sat in a class in story writing at Stanford, I remember the experience very clearly. I was bright-eyes and bushy-brained and prepared to absorb the secret formula for writing good short stories, even great short stories. This illusion was canceled very quickly. The only way to write a good short story, we were told, is to write a good short story. Only after it is written can it be taken apart to see how it was done. It is a most difficult form, as we were told, and the proof lies in how very few great short stories there are in the world.

The basic rule given us was simple and heartbreaking. A story to be effective had to convey something from the writer to the reader, and the power of its offering was the measure of its excellence. Outside of that, there were no rules. A story could be about anything and could use any means and any technique at all - so long as it was effective. As a subhead to this rule, it seemed to be necessary for the writer to know what he wanted to say, in short, what he was talking about. As an exercise we were to try reducing the meat of our story to one sentence, for only then could we know it well enough to enlarge it to three- or six- or ten-thousand words.

So there went the magic formula, the secret ingredient. With no more than that, we were set on the desolate, lonely path of the writer. And we must have turned in some abysmally bad stories. If I had expected to be discovered in a full bloom of excellence, the grades given my efforts quickly disillusioned me. And if I felt unjustly criticized, the judgments of editors for many years afterward upheld my teacher's side, not mine. The low grades on my college stories were echoed in the rejection slips, in the hundreds of rejection slips.

    
It seemed unfair. I could read a fine story and could even know how it was done. Why could I not then do it myself? Well, I couldn't, and maybe it's because no two stories dare be alike. Over the years I have written a great many stories and I still don't know how to go about it except to write it and take my chances.     

If there is a magic in story writing, and I am convinced there is, no one has ever been able to reduce it to a recipe that can be passed from one person to another. The formula seems to lie solely in the aching urge of the writer to convey something he feels important to the reader. If the writer has that urge, he may sometimes, but by no means always, find the way to do it. You must perceive the excellence that makes a good story good or the errors that makes a bad story. For a bad story is only an ineffective story.    

It is not so very hard to judge a story after it is written, but, after many years, to start a story still scares me to death. I will go so far as to say that the writer who not scared is happily unaware of the remote and tantalizing majesty of the medium.     

I remember one last piece of advice given me. It was during the exuberance of the rich and frantic '20s, and I was going out into that world to try and to be a writer.     

I was told, "It's going to take a long time, and you haven't got any money. Maybe it would be better if you could go to Europe."     

"Why?" I asked.     

"Because in Europe poverty is a misfortune, but in America it is shameful. I wonder whether or not you can stand the shame of being poor."     

It wasn't too long afterward that the depression came. Then everyone was poor and it was no shame anymore. And so I will never know whether or not I could have stood it. But surely my teacher was right about one thing. It took a long time - a very long time. And it is still going on, and it has never got easier.       She told me it wouldn't.

Guardian Using CST to Beat Michael Gove

It seems strange to me that The Guardian would take issue with the allocation of £2 million towards providing security at Jewish schools. Yet here they are doing just that.

Apparently the problem is that Michael Gove the education secretary, has been an advisor to the Community Security Trust (CST) for 4 years prior to handing out the grant to them therefore his doling out the money to them presents "a conflict of interest".

I am not really sure who would be doling out the cash if it wasn't the secretary for education, CST hve already come out with a blog post of their own saying that;


"CST is astonished that the Guardian has chosen to mark Holocaust Memorial Day by attacking the funding provided by the government to pay for security guarding at Jewish state schools in England and Wales."


I can't blame them for feeling a bit hard done by and it looks to me like The Guardian are making something out of nothing simply in order to have a go at Gove and by extension the government. This is a pretty dangerous thing to do as the implication now is that tax money is being mis-spent by providing extra security to Jewish schools.

Pub or Bird?

I have made the mistake of going out with a girl who works at my favourite bar.

Yes, I know, a child's mistake you might say but what's done is done...and now I have to figure out how to rectify the situation.

For those of you who haven't figured out the problem yet it goes like this;

So far things are going well with her, which means I can't go to the pub any more because it will look like I am stalking her, spying on her, seeing too much of her in a non date situation and generally acting in some kind of smothering way.

What's more is that if I do go to the pub and get completely wasted she's...well...she's gonna see me completely wasted and...well...that won't be good (unless she's wasted too). Mind you, it was when I was getting completely wasted that I met her in the first place so that may not be all that bad. Also if things keep going well and I decide I need some alone time there's no way it's going to happen now.

If things go badly then there's no way I am going to be able to go back to the bar as there would be weirdness between us.

Anyway my handful of readers (I think I have that many) this is a problem and it means that rather than walk the 3 minutes it takes to get to my favourite and local bar tonight I will be walking 25 minutes to my semi favourite and in no way local bar instead.

They say it's better to share but after having written this...

Israel Under Cyber Attack!

 Internet hacking is not unknown by any means but the latest round of cyber-attacks have put us all on notice that the closed world of hackers has opened up on all of us with potentially devastating consequences. According to Danny Ayalon, Deputy foreign Minister; "Cyberspace is the new battleground and there too we will not be defeated. We will not be intimidated, threatened or silenced," he said.

Be that as it may, the Saudi hacker 0x Omar and the hacking group Nightmare, have shown us just how vulnerable we are to individuals operating thousands of miles away. Revenge was swift as Hannibal and a group called the IDF Team, claiming to be representing Israel, released 100,000 usernames and passwords supposedly for Arabs on Facebook and took down several websites in Arab countries. It later turned out that many of the Facebook usernames and passwords were for people who were in no way connected with the Middle East. In fact the idea that these cyber warriors are operating on behalf of anyone is a nonsense.

What the latest spate of hacking shows is just how vulnerable both individuals and massive institutions are to concerted attack. It is now crystal clear just how much power is possessed by those few people who know how to cut to the heart of the online systems that we depend on so much. These cyber- attacks were launched at individuals and businesses rather than states, the release of tens of thousands of Israelis credit card details caused significant disruption to the lives of Israelis and Hannibal’s revenge attack on Facebook caused disruption to 100,000 people in a single blow.

The means of waging war have changed, that became clear with the Stuxnet virus released on the Iranian nuclear programme, if not before. Though with Stuxnet the illusion of safety was maintained by the fact that this was an attacked launched at one state by (presumably) another state or states. While this was the case we could all watch from the side lines as though hacking were a spectator sport, but now it is has gotten personal. The people who are going to be the victims of this tit for tat hacking war are innocent people hit at random. These ‘cyberwarriors’ are going head to head in a war that is more about showing off their computer skills to one another than actual events in the Middle East, and it has only just begun.

**UPDATE**

Earlier today the Ha'aretz Habrew site was overwelmed by hackers, the Pro Palestinian group Anonymous took responsibility on Twitter according to Ha'aretz English edition.

The Sheba and Assouta Medical Centre's sites were also brought down and though both sites were brought back online it is unclear what damage has been done/information stolen from patient's files during the attack.

The website of the Israel Festival was also hacked and the content replaced, some exerpts of the message left by the hacker (according to Google Translate) says the following:

"This Site Hacked By Watchful Eye Hacker, Death For Israel, death to Israel This Site Hacked By Watchful Eye Hacker" 

"Dedicate these breakthroughs to everyone who contributed to my education and especially to my brothers in the team Dz-SeC Team and Gaza Hacker Team and HacKErS HoMe and web spiders professionalism and a team v4-team and Sec4ever Team and I apologize if I did not mention anyone as Ahidiha to all lovers and friends and to all Arabs and Muslims ..."

These coordinated attacks make it clear that those looking to bring down Israeli sites are not discriminating between the left and the right wing of society nor military institutions and civilian ones. Last time Israeli sites were attacked sites in Saudi Arabia were attacked by Israeli hackers in retaliation.

The only question that remains is, who will be targeted next?

Amazing Country/ Eretz Nehderet

Well it was bound to happen eventually and now Israel's popular TV comedy skit show Eretz Nehederet has parodied American Birthright tourists, quite badly in my opinion, but it should be fun to see whether it has any effects on the wider Jewish world.

To be fair to them Taglit/Birthright have taken it all in their stride saying that "the most prominent comedy television show in Israel, has put Taglit-Birthright Israel on the agenda as one of the most important programs in the Jewish world.”

Pottered!

I have just finished the final Harry Potter book and I sorely tempted to start reading them all from the beginning once again just to relive the fun I had with this fantastic story.

Every once in a while a writer comes along with the ability to take the reader of their story into an entirely different world, to make them forget their troubles, to make them forget their reality and to allow them to see only the fantasy that the writer has conjured up using the words on a printed page.

The genius of Harry Potter or rather of J K Rowling, is not the broad concept of a world where wizards and witches exist but of her ability to paint a dramatic portrait of an invented world through the strength of her creation and the creatures inhabiting it. JK Rowling's power comes from the detail with which she has created her imaginary world. From the description of Hogwarts all the way down to the foundation, the creation of fantastic foods, magical plants and even a whole new sport she has created something that has universal appeal. She did not stop there, she created a whole new unit of currency and banking facilities for the wizards and witches inhabiting her fantasy world as well as laws concerning the magic they are able to use.

The books seamlessly fit into one another making each of the 7 integral parts in an ongoing story rather than a series of adventures concerning the 3 principle characters Ron, Hermione and Harry. The relationship between Harry and the various characters who form a part of his life makes the work all the more endearing. The teachers at Hogwarts, the surrogate family of the Weasley's together with his own relatives the Dursley's and his very different nemeses Voldemort and Malfoy all ensure that there is a continual narrative that sees the main character develop from boy to man.

This exquisite story explores as gently as any other, the best and the worst human beings are capable of, our lust for power along with our need for companionship. This great saga will stand up throughout the years as one of the great works of our generation.

Bye Press TV You Will be Missed

The Guardian report that the notorious English language propaganda are of the Iranian regime has had its license taken away by the regulatory board Ofcom.

I must confess to feeling a deep sense of satisfaction at this news but at the same time I urge people to spare a thought for all of the rich British politicians who are going to need to find themselves a new dictatorial regime to speak for.

Jeremy Corbyn Labour MP for Islington North:

Ken Livingstone, London's next Mayor?

George Galloway, former MP:

I hear that Bashar Al-Assad is looking for friendly Parliamentarians to put across his perspective...

The Asajew

This post in the CST Blog got me thinking about Jews who take every opportunity to very publicly attack Israel.

There is an interesting group of people out there in the world and every once in a while they call themselves Jews. They do so in order to make it absolutely clear that people attacking Israel are not doing it because they hate Jews, in fact the mere notion that anti-Semitism can be involved in anti Israel activities is surely a nonsense by the mere act of the participation of such people, so the theory goes.

These asajew characters tend to have one thing in common, they use their Judaism as an excuse to attack Israel.

You're unlikely to find them in shul and you won't find them at the Seder table, you won't find them at a Shiva and you won't find them at a Bar Mitzvah either. The only place you'll find the 'asajew' is standing at an anti Israel event screaming about how Jewish they are and how much they hate Israel. For them one cannot be without the other.

My personal favourite asajew is Alexei Sayle the former communist who never went to shul in his life but who still happily stands up and portrays himself as Jewish. As a patron of the Palestine Solidarity Campaign (PSC) it is clear what his views are on Israel and that is fair enough, but for some reason he feels it necessary to take that one extra step and criticise Israel asajew.

In times when there is unrest against Israel you will find him there stoking the fire asajew.

It's not just good old Alexei there are several people born to Jewish families whose Judaism occupies no part of their lives other than when it comes to criticising Israel. Tony Greenstein is a name that crops up in this respect. Describing himself as being born to an orthodox Jewish family he has long since given up on his roots save for when he has the opportunity to give an asajew speech.

Another one who loves to use her Jewish heritage to make it to the foreground is Deborah Fink. A music teacher who just loves to use her Jewish background to make Jews everywhere feel crappy. Here she is in one of my all time favourite youtube videos.

Another fantastic asajew is Sir Gerald Kaufman MP. The videos say it all:

and here:

So when Israel next does something that has thousands of people attacking police and screaming for blood outside the Israeli embassy keep your eyes peeled for someone who never goes to shul yet is calling themselves Jewish and standing somewhere prominent being a real asajew.

You'll know what to call them!

More examples of great asajews are welcome.

Robin Simcox: Guantanamo and Its Critics - WSJ.com

Robin Simcox: Guantanamo and Its Critics - WSJ.com:

It was just so obvious that it was bound to come out some time...

'via Blog this'

The Righter Perspective

Somehow I managed to get into a debate with a Rabbi on my Facebook page yesterday after writing this post.

Would be nice to hear what people think of the views expressed here:

• • Lilia Kolesova: Why rub salt into wounds now? The deal is sealed, the majority of the Israeli population was willing to release these murderers in exchange for our soldier. What's done can't be undone. It just brings scary thoughts such as how long the murderers of the Vogel family will stay in jail? After all these procedures and the verdict?
    

    22 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Why? Cause if you don't learn from your mistakes, you're condemned to repeat them over and over again. That's what this insane country does, repeat the same mistakes over and over again. Btw, how do we know that the "majority" of the population was for this ridiculous deal? Did someone take a vote?
    

    21 hours ago ·  ·  1
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    Marc Goldberg It's hardly rubbing salt into the wound to point out exactly what was risked in order to pick up just one of these guys, nor am I saying it was a bad deal, but better to know exactly what the situation is than live in ignorance
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Marc, how can it be a "good" deal?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg How can what be a good idea?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    to release 1000 convicted murderers for one Israeli soldier?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg Well you'll see if you check that Israel didn't release 1000 convicted murderers at all
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    By your own account, we released at least one of them, and we know for a fact that hundreds more were released. These were dangerous terrorists, many of whom were released practically within our midst...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg This is true, the answer is subjective, ethical and philosophical the question really is how much was Gilad worth to you? There is only opinion here no absolute right or wrong
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: Not all of the released Arabs are murderers - that's already good news. Any deal with terrorists is rediculous, especially of this kind, it just increases their appetite... But at least we are progressing - getting in exchange one soldier, alive, not like in the past - dead bodies and a drug dealer for the same amount of terrorists :( Though I think it is important to bring even dead bodies back home and bury them with dignity, only they should be returned in exchange for the enemy's dead bodies, not live criminals who plan to continue with their crimes... There is no logic indeed in these deals but noone seems to care about this insanity if it happens to Israel...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Hey, in 1985 Peres released 1500 terrorists, for I think 3 live Israeli soldiers (the infamous "iskat jabril" that resulted in the first intifada), so I'm not sure at all that we're making progress. But, as a rabbi I'm disturbed that we don't look back into Jewish history and learn from what happened to the Jews hundreds and even thousands of years ago. This isn't the first time that we're faced with captive situations, it's unfortunately a common theme in our bloody history. And the halacha gives guidance how to deal with it, but of course we can't expect the likes of Peres or Bibi to take that into account...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova So, David Sterne, what are we supposed to do according to Halacha?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg David once again I am not sure your facts are correct, the first Intifada was started by a car accident in Gaza that resulted in the deaths of several Palestinians and then riots emanated from there
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    We don't capitulate to demands, that's the underlying principle because as you pointed out, otherwise it just whets the appetite of the other side to make more and more demands. In fact the most famous case was of a rabbi captured in Germany in the fifteenth century and he told his congregants NOT to redeem him for the money that was demanded...he unfortunately died in captivity...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg You didn't really address answer Lilia's question at all, what does the Halacha say?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: So is it ok according Halacha if a fellow Jew dies in captivity?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: Then Putin might be Jewish ;)
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Marc, you really think that a car accident in Gaza ignited years of vicious rock throwing all over Israel? The terrorists that Peres released went on to train and incite all over Israel for the purpose of killing Jews...and I did answer Lili's question, it's just that thhis is not the place to cite the code so I gave the general principle and the most famous precedent...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: as he prefers to sacrifice his own people not to give in to Chechenian terrorists
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Lili, I don't want to say that it's "okay," because then I sound heartless and cold, but after all the rabbi did die in captivity, and upon his own directive - so obviously that was meant to be an example for us. What the halacha tells us is that it that preference must be given to the collective Jewish people over the individual. That is what the mass release of terrorists tramples all over...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: But Rabbi Stern, what about sacredness of life? I was really thinking about it, what would be a religious point of view in the Shalit case?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: Sorry, my fb is slow so I didn't see your comment... But then it sounds to me like Communism... :(
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg David the interesting thing about the first Intifada was the tactics used that involved throwing rocks and tended to shun the use of large scale killing, that was why the IDF found it so difficult to deal with them since it had never seen this kind of mass demonstration before.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    funny about Putin, but the halalacha doesn't apply...of course we're talking about "sacredness of life" here, and the sacredness of the collective jewish people takes precedence over the life of one unfortunate soul...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Marc, don't forget that those rocks were thrown at windshields of cars traveling fast enough to kill their passengers. they weren't tossing softballs...they were out to kill and sometimes they succeeded.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova: Are Jews not supposed to try to release the unfortunate soul in a military op if possible?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg It seems that the few are always deciding what's best for the many and a different few are always the ones being sacrificed for their vision
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Lili, not communism, but common sense within the realm of halacha...if you give Israeli governments long enough they might just come to the same conclusion as the halacha, but why not just learn from our past and prevent the insane mistakes?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg I have another story it's called Hansel and Gretel I am sure there is a lot to be learned there too...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Mamash, for sure that's what we should have done is release him in a military situation and that was part of why we went into Gaza, remember our friend Max? He went in with Givati and they were told they weren't leaving without Gilad. they sat on their tuchuses for three weeks while Ashkenazi, Barak and Olmert dilly-dallied and the result is well known.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Lilia Kolesova What about "Save one life, save a whole world"? I do not agree with Marc about preference of the few to leave another few behind... A son of a Halacha scholar can be taken captive as well...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Mofaz had a good idea and maybe Marc can tell us if it was doable...Mofaz suggested to "eliminate" one Hamas guy a week until they release Gilad. Chaval that we didn't at least try that...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Marc, why Hansel and Gretel, cause they're from fifteenth century Germany? Only problem is they weren't jewish...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg It would have been doable sure, would it have worked? I doubt very much and more to the point why should we become as evil as our enemies? Wher eis your morality? We are very proud and always talking about the differences between us and Hamas yet you seem to espouse becoming just like them
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg No because it is also a fairy tale
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Oh, please this is the kind of cr*p that I really cannot stand. Since when are we being "evil" when we undertake whatever is necessary to get our guys back? Since when is the blood of the enemy redder than our own? What kind of thinking is that?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Well, Marc, I see that you are really detached from anything Jewish if you can equate Jewish history with fairy tales. If so, you are truly condemned to repeat the past mistakes...and there is another name for that as well, it's called insanity.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg You are way off base, you conflate killing Palestinians with helping Israel somehow, you conflate killing a Hamas guy a day with a rescue plan for bringing Gilad home they are not the same thing.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg As for undertaking whatever is necessary to bring Gilad home, we did undertake exactly what was necessary to bring him home and it is exactly that that you are complaining about
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg How do you expect me to have a reasoned debate with you when you consistently give incorrect information and advocate murder based on somethign that happened to a rabbi in mediaeval times?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Excuse me my friend, but fancy ethics doesn't come into play here. I don't care if they are so-called Palestinians, Germand, or Putins. If someone takes our guys, we shed whatever blood of the other side is necessary in order to get them back. This is not a matter of "becoming like them." It is a matter of survivial, and don't think for a minute that they look at it any differently.
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg Once again you fail to address any of my points and go off on one about how we are on the verge of an apocalypse, once again how do you expect me to have a rational argument with you?
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Nice ending argument, Marc...when you see you've lost the debate all of a sudden you decide I haven't addressed the point. Ask anyone else following this discussion if I've addressed the point or not...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg I see so you win your debates by declaring yourself the winner? Go for it
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    I say I have addressed the points and you don't seem to have any answers, so you resort to trying to invalidate the whole discussion, which you by the way initiated...
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg I don't understand how you can say that, how you can have not seen a single thing I have written, your argument is simple in a nutshell you advocate killing Palestinians until we get what we want, I disagree
    

    21 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    In case I didn't make it clear, the suggestion came from Mofaz, and it was not to kill random people, but to target the "heads" of the organization and their minions...
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg Oh I see it is Mofaz who is the evil one you were just repeating his idea and calling it good, and said "one hamas guy a day" now it is the "heads" of the organisation talk about backtracking
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Excuse me sir, but try not to argue by being insulting...there is no backtracking here, there is only your own misunderstanding.
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg In your points about the first Intifada you were factually incorrect as to how it started, in your points about "releasing 1000 convicted murderers" you were factually incorrect and you say that I am misunderstanding? Like I said just now your answer is simple, kill Palestinians, if there is a problem, kill Palestinians, I disagree, more than that I find your ideas abhorrent, leave now for all the good you have done.
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    ‎"leave now"? What's that mean?
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go" If you know who said it I'll give you a cookie
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    Thanks, buddy, you're quite amusing...let me recommend that you learn to deal with opinions that don't agree with, you'll be a happier man for it. "Out, damn spot!" Who do you think said that?
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg So you patronise, obfuscate, advocate murder and then you leave...well you have certainly done a good job of...
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    yesss?
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg I'm trying to think of something you have done well here tonight, give me a moment I am sure there is something
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    keep working on it...
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg you can leave my FB page in peace now
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    David Sterne · Friends with Barak Seener and 9 others

    thanks, nice of you to give me permission...
    

    20 hours ago · 
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    Marc Goldberg and blocked you are